I don't understand why Monday is not "blocked" from a votive Mass for the dead but Tuesday is. I would have thought that the "resumed Sunday" would have "blocked" the Monday, not the Tuesday. What am I missing? John
John, The resumed Mass of the Sunday is said on the lowest-ranking liturgical day of the week in which it is resumed. So a simple feast, on Monday, outranked the ferial day on Tuesday. Having the resumed Mass on that day changed what Votive Masses could be celebrated.
Just an aside, but after Restore the '54 Facebook group put out an interview between yourself and The Rad Trad concerning the 1983 events in the SSPX, Louis Tofari went all out, falsifying history, saying that the SSPX only ever used the '60s liturgical books, and never pre-1955, basically calling you a liar! Then he had the temerity to put out again that poor defense of the 1960s reforms by Fr. Marcello: https://www.romanitaspress.com/abp-lefebvre-on-pius-xii-reforms Tofari has went down to a new low!
There was a video on YouTube of $$PX history showing, short, clips of folded chasubles on Good Friday at the London hurch plus extant newsletters showing the old liturgy being used etc.
Revisionism has always been a strong feature of the $$PX and its supporters.
What are the strict rubrics for the joining of the lessons? From what I've read, only the 9th Lesson of a Vigil, Sunday, or Ember day can have all 3 lessons joined, and at the most, the eighth lesson of a Sunday homily can be joined to the ninth (though that occurs rarely). I've been so used to the freedom of the pre-DA rubrics, of combining the Incipit of the book with the current feria, and combining the 8th lessons with the 9th of all saints, Sundays, etc.
Yes. Or rather the Mass of the simplex feast to be said in lieu of the resumed Sunday at private Masses. The other sources keep showing disagreement on little details like the 3rd collect, giving the temporal collects but not requiring that one be of Sunday, but I wonder what their justification is: it seems like the Mass should be treated analogously to a Lenten ferial day.
In this case the main Sancta Missa page of DivinumOfficium would not reflect the simplex feast but in other cases it’s clear that there’s a common misunderstanding as DivinumOfficium and one or both Ordos (sorry, the plural is a bit hard) share a difference from the Saint Lawrence Ordo. And as I usually catch these things, I like to be, well, right , when telling Fr Marcello et al what to fix, and I try to find a historical ordo if I can, but as you have found, that’s imperfect too.
Matthew (29/8), My apologies as I was confusing myself yesterday! A&V I, 6 is clear that when the Mass of a preceding Sunday is to be resumed private Masses are either of that Sunday with other occurring commemorations. If the Mass of the simple feast, simple octave day, or day within an octave is celebrated then the Sunday has to be commemorated in that.
John, You are welcome as always. I was looking at the wrong week when I replied but the answer holds in that the resumed Sunday is said on the liturgically lowest ranking day of the following week. If all days are semi-double, or above, it simply gets omitted.
I don't understand why Monday is not "blocked" from a votive Mass for the dead but Tuesday is.
ReplyDeleteI would have thought that the "resumed Sunday" would have "blocked" the Monday, not the Tuesday.
What am I missing?
John
John,
DeleteThe resumed Mass of the Sunday is said on the lowest-ranking liturgical day of the week in which it is resumed. So a simple feast, on Monday, outranked the ferial day on Tuesday. Having the resumed Mass on that day changed what Votive Masses could be celebrated.
Just an aside, but after Restore the '54 Facebook group put out an interview between yourself and The Rad Trad concerning the 1983 events in the SSPX, Louis Tofari went all out, falsifying history, saying that the SSPX only ever used the '60s liturgical books, and never pre-1955, basically calling you a liar! Then he had the temerity to put out again that poor defense of the 1960s reforms by Fr. Marcello: https://www.romanitaspress.com/abp-lefebvre-on-pius-xii-reforms Tofari has went down to a new low!
ReplyDeleteThere was a video on YouTube of $$PX history showing, short, clips of folded chasubles on Good Friday at the London hurch plus extant newsletters showing the old liturgy being used etc.
DeleteRevisionism has always been a strong feature of the $$PX and its supporters.
What are the strict rubrics for the joining of the lessons? From what I've read, only the 9th Lesson of a Vigil, Sunday, or Ember day can have all 3 lessons joined, and at the most, the eighth lesson of a Sunday homily can be joined to the ninth (though that occurs rarely). I've been so used to the freedom of the pre-DA rubrics, of combining the Incipit of the book with the current feria, and combining the 8th lessons with the 9th of all saints, Sundays, etc.
ReplyDeletePaul,
DeleteFrom memory the DA rubrics just refer to the single lesson (of what is being commemorated by a 9th lesson) being said.
Again I am just mystified at the difference in the understanding of the rubrics.
ReplyDeleteOther pre-55 sources have the third collect ad libitum if Mass is said of the simplex feast. But in that case the Sunday totally disappears.
Are you referring to the Mass of a resumed Sunday?
DeleteYes. Or rather the Mass of the simplex feast to be said in lieu of the resumed Sunday at private Masses. The other sources keep showing disagreement on little details like the 3rd collect, giving the temporal collects but not requiring that one be of Sunday, but I wonder what their justification is: it seems like the Mass should be treated analogously to a Lenten ferial day.
DeleteIn this case the main Sancta Missa page of DivinumOfficium would not reflect the simplex feast but in other cases it’s clear that there’s a common misunderstanding as DivinumOfficium and one or both Ordos (sorry, the plural is a bit hard) share a difference from the Saint Lawrence Ordo. And as I usually catch these things, I like to be, well, right , when telling Fr Marcello et al what to fix, and I try to find a historical ordo if I can, but as you have found, that’s imperfect too.
Matthew (29/8),
ReplyDeleteMy apologies as I was confusing myself yesterday! A&V I, 6 is clear that when the Mass of a preceding Sunday is to be resumed private Masses are either of that Sunday with other occurring commemorations. If the Mass of the simple feast, simple octave day, or day within an octave is celebrated then the Sunday has to be commemorated in that.
Thank you. I didn't realize that there was a choice of day for the Sunday commemoration. I will eventually learn all of this.
ReplyDeleteJohn
John,
ReplyDeleteYou are welcome as always. I was looking at the wrong week when I replied but the answer holds in that the resumed Sunday is said on the liturgically lowest ranking day of the following week. If all days are semi-double, or above, it simply gets omitted.